BTSC Politics: GIF raises 62.5 billion!

[The Enforcer!]

In today's press this is highlighted as being ready to go next month.

Anyone know if this is true or just pre-Electioneering?

The Enforcer!

[Wisarut]

Well, Suriya said they are going to do so ... and imposing 15 Baht flat rate -> just folliwng the Seoul Subway whcih apply 20 Baht fare rate for the tickets....

Sound like a populist propaganda indeed ... ONLy a DAMNED FOOLS would BELIEVE his LIE for 15 baht flat rate!

For the case of Seoul, they can produce theri own Subway rolling stocks for exportation ... so the cost is lower ... Even so, both companies who Run Seoul subway are in very deep in BLOODY RED.


For the case of OTP Plan, it can be described as follows:

Total Cost: 521.619 Billion Baht
Services: 165.486 Billion Baht -> 55 billion from the Budget and the rest of services from 110.486 Billion Baht Loan
Infrastructure: 356.133 Billion Baht -> 150 billion Baht from Budget, 36 billion Baht from nationalization at very bargianing price and then sell an IPO at very high price, 170.333 billion Baht from BMA such as the new automobile license fee, fuel funds, the toll from the cars passing through Ratchadaphisek, Rveune from the land management, and the service revenues from Skytrian and SUbway.

So far so good ...

[forumadmin]

I did see the news item about the government purchasing the Skytrain/Subway () but the details were so sketchy I decided not to post it... It sounds like it was what they hoped would happen...

[The Enforcer!]

Originally posted by admin
It sounds like it was what they hoped would happen...

Quite understand your views. I was not sure if it was because a certain "independent" gubernatorial candidate (who may not have a degree) has been talking at meeting about low BTS/MRTA fares!!

But then I have suspicious nature!!!

The Enforcer!

[Nekochan]

TPP is what I call it.

Remember when Khun Samak announced 10 Baht flat rate for BTS? He didn't make it.

Thai government is trying to undermine the progress of mass transit projects. There are lots of economists who disagreed and I think they are right. Using taxpayer money in a very unwised way.

BTS.....They have gone all alone without any supports. They are debted ridden and nobody cares. OH! Khun Kiree will never sell his stock for sure.

We can go forward but we need your stock!! (WE NEED THAT CHEAP,TOO!)

Particularly when Mr. Suriya said about 15 Baht fare. Considering how much BMCL earned daily based on 10 Baht fare ..... revenue was 2 MB daily. You can earn more with distance based fare + flat fares to attracts passengers from all segments.

15 Baht is just like 30 Baht medical treatment ....... that's another form of populist policies.

Even they make it, I do not think I can built a complete mass transit network within 6 years. Seoul took almost 30 years and it is still expanding. DC since 1973 but it is also expanding!!

Who said about traffic solution within 6 months in 1996, but changed to 6 years later???

Big Jeuw (Gen Chavalitr) did that within 2 months!! ($1 = 50 Baht), that's why he was not drown himself in Mae Kong River (he achieved something Traffic Policy Office should be proud of!!).

[The Enforcer!]

An overall cheap transport system (integrated BTS, MRTA, SRT and Buses) does make sense and can work (see London in early 1980s) but NOT if you still allow 12,000 new cars a WEEK onto the roads!!

Sadly, all I see and hear are cheap, political posturing!!

The Enforcer!

[ncr]

Re: Govt should finance sky train project with offshore loans
The Nation, Apr 07 , 2005

Excerpts:

"The government should seek Bt70 billion in offshore loans to invest in new seven routes of the elevated electric train system in order to alleviate government's budget spending."

But apparently this refers to the mass transit lines in the master plan, which is limited to subway and SRT. 7 new Skytrain routes??? Misleading!

"The new seven routes elevated train project needs a total investment of Bt410 billion, where Bt280 billion will come from the state to finance the construction of tunnels and rails and the remaining Bt130 billion from the private sector for locomotives and bogies."

Ever seen an elevated train running in a tunnel?
(Well, it might be thinkable in certain (special) settings, such as a rail line through mountainous terrain with a succession of bridges and tunnels, but definitely not in Bangkok!)

Of course we (=informed 2Bangkok readers) know what this is all about -- and that long stretches of the so-called subway extensions will in fact be elevated lines -- but the general public doesn't!

[ncr]

And another instance:

"Anat Arbhabhiroma, adviser to BTS, which runs the Skytrain, said the operator is ready and able to operate extended light-rail lines from On Nut to Samrong and Taksin Bridge to Petkasem."
(from MASS TRANSIT EXTENSION: MRTA seeks wider govt role, The Nation, 18 April 2005)

I doubt he said that (or he must be a badly informed adviser - but I'd rather think the reporter screwed it up)..... The Skytrain is not a light-rail system.

[Nekochan]

No, it is not! But some people think it is.

Worst of all, some transport news is from OTP itself. They create public misunderstandings for many aspects since they misunderstand several things.

Farang transport engineers here just keep shaking their heads in disbelief. Just like 5 years' mass transit plan which they eventually khow they will not make it. Now it is a 10 years's plan.

Blame it on OPEC (oil price).

[White Nancy]

K Nekochan,

Here's one Farang transport consultant shaking his head in the UK as we speak!

I saw all this in the papers when I was out the other week and was confused then. It doesn't get any better.

I'm back out there the week after next to try to bottom out the Korat HSR issue. We are looking to persuade SRT that standard gauge is the way to go. We'll see!

[Nekochan]

Khun White Nancy,

I presume you do not understand Thai. That's an advantage. So, you do not have to answer silly questions to transport committee about what speed flow curve is......

Or how did you do your analysis?

I know that there are no FS studies of Yellow and Pink lines. Mr. 20% just decided and BANG! OTP jumped into conclusion it was good.

You have master plan but no ridership forecast, no fare test ...... just nothing but in time for the election

[Wisarut]

ShinCorp Trying to Takeover BTS
Thairath - July 15, 2005

Now,the creditors got the contact from ShinCorps that ShinCorps is going
to buy the BTS Debts from the creditors such as KfW and otehr domestic creditors -> at the 50% discounted price (from the current 850 million US$ for KfW case and 13 billion Baht for domestic creditors suchasIFCTwhcih has been taken over by TMB[the checkbook of ShinCorps], and SCB) to
takeover BTSC.

After the debt buyout, Shincorps would ask BTSC to cut down the registered capital to payoff the debts and raise the ticket prices to 45 baht ceiling.

Even today, BTSCstill operate at loss ...indefinitely posepone the IPO despite of the 400000 passengers a day ... Failture toperform debt restructure woudl discourage the company from offer IPO.

[Hitesh]

so i suppose this now means the skytrain has permission to lay tracks wherever it wants to.

[Wisarut]

This measurement has come up asthe governemnt has found than they have to little Baht and Dollars in theri coffer to do this Nationalization scheme.

Furthermore, the cost overrrun by 4 billion Baht even without digging the tunnel due to fuel hike and baht depreciation ... with the additional 8 billion Baht inthe case of digging 4-km tunnel for purple line and the additional 20 billion Baht for digging both tunnels for purple line and blue ring ....

Now, MTHAI.com have barred me from postign my comments because my comments are so CAUSTIC and ACIDIC that those who live in Taopoon have asked MTHAI.com to PROHIBIT me from participating the webboard by locking the IP Address.

[Pas]

They barred you? that's too drastic!!!

Can the govt forces KfW to sell Shin BTS share at 50% discount price? is that legal?

What about BMA, I thought they already budgeted for the skytrain expansion civil works?
I do feel for the Kanjanapas family though - not because their wealth is dwindling, but because they, of all people, have the guts to stick with this project from the beginning. Too bad if the company can't go public.